Attempted install problems

Jerry, I think you drew the one unlucky number out of 99 lucky ones. Why these problems happen from time to time they don't usually happen at once: for example I wrote in the Wiki the recommandation to use CDR not CDRW because usually CDRs are better for this purpose (however CDRW should work too, you might have a batch of low quality disks) Also it's a good idea to burn the CD at low speed.

I agree QTParted is not very good tool, but at least is free, but if you have Partition Magic use that for partitioning.

I'm not sure what is the problem with GRUB, I've heard of instances when people had problems but usually it was because they had strange hardware configuration: 2-3 drives that were not set up right as master/slave. Please give us more details: what type of drive SATA or IDE? There are other ways to install MEPIS without using GRUB, look here or some ways: www.mepis.org/docs/en/index.php/Alternative_boot_methods

If you don't give up you'll succeed.
--
Check out Mepis wiki: www.mepis.org/docs

Hi Jerry: Don't quit too soon, people over here don't quit easy . Have a read here:

http://www.mepis.org/docs/en/index.php/Main_Page

Did you burn a release version or the Beta?

Wayne

I read the docs that were recommended by both of the responders. Lots of good info there that I had overlooked during earlier searches.
As for the questions, my version is the latest release, not beta. I have 2 drives in my machine the 74 gig Raptor is SATA, & the 60 gig is IDE. They are configed as master & slave. I attempted to install on the IDE & sent GRUB to the SATA MBR. Spooked the bejeebers out of me when the "GRUB" flashed a million times across the screen.
Thanks again for the comebacks. I'll do some more reading & give it some more trials soon. I'm sitting air ambulance alert for another week. Man, am I looking forward to spring.

Thanks, Jerry

and a few things flash a million times across my brain
you can't have things set up exactly like that
because the SATA and PATA (IDE) need to be on different cables
if there is one drive on the SATA cable then it is master
and if there is one drive on the IDE cable where is the cd/dvd drive?
In order to help sort this out
we need to know if the IDE drive shares a cable with the CD / DVD or if there are two IDE cables in use
and then check that the CD/DVD is master or slave and that the HDD is the other (because only people like me have multiple PATA cables and multiple SATA cables)

when you have the livecd running you could copy and paste the /etc/fstab file into this forum - that would help.

and in my past I've done air ambulance work - all the best for a quiet New Year period

Hi Drlizau.
I just checked the bios settings on my box, & the following list is how my drives are installed:
1. IDE Channel 0 Master = Sony CD
IDE Channel 0 Slave = Liteon DVDRW
(Both are connected via a single ribbon cable)
2. IDE Channel 1 Master = None
IDE Channel 1 Slave = Maxtor IDE 60 Gig (On a standard IDE cable, but only one connecter used)
3. IDE Channel 2 Master = WD SATA 74 Gig (On a single SATA cable)
IDE Channel 2 Slave = None
4. IDE Channels 3, 4, & 5 = None

The WD SATA is the "C" boot drive. It is unpartitioned.
The Maxtor is partitioned into 2 drives.
I also have a 1.44 floppy installed.

All of the drives function as they should (I think). I built the box about 9 months ago.

I hate to admit my stupidity; however, I am pretty clueless as to how to locate the "/etc/fstab" file you mentioned. I understand how to locate such things in Windows, but am at a loss in Linux. BTW, I do not have Linux installed now. Do you mean copy the file after running the CD? Will I be able to write a file to a Windows drive?

Thanks for your patience,
Jerry in Anchorage

if you boot with the liveCD, it will make a custom /etc/fstab according to your hardware.

log in and then open a konsole
Alt-F2
konsole
now type
cat /etc/fstab

you can save this to a FAT32 filesystem from the live CD
but a floppy or a USB stick is a simple way

but you should be able to get on the 'net and logon here
that was what I was assuming

If you have a broadband connection, when you boot with the livecd, your internet connection should be live and you can post directly to this forum without having to write any files to a fat32 filesystem.

I agree with what drlizau is saying, but I think it would be easier for you to log in to this forum from the live cd, follow her instructions, then highlight the text with your mouse, then click on Edit, then copy, then paste it into this forum, but make sure you do not close the konsole window before pasting the data into this forum or it may be lost, such is a possible limitation of a livecd system.

While the bios information is a good start, it does little to assist us with the configuration of your system because Linux uses a totally different approach than what you're used to for booting operating systems.

When viewing connected mass storage devices on the IDE channels, linux identifies them as such
Primary Master = hda
Primary Slave = hdb
Secondary Master = hdc
Secondary Slave = hdd

So in your case...

IDE Channel 0 Master = Sony CD ..... would be hda
IDE Channel 0 Slave = Liteon DVDRW . would be hdb
IDE Channel 1 Master = None
IDE Channel 1 Slave = Maxtor60 Gig . would be hdd.

The SATA system is similar and providing you've got your drive plugged into the first SATA port on your motherboard, it would show up in Linux as sda1, but I have seen some systems that start the sata channels at sde
Western Digital 74 Gig ... should be sda

This is about half of the information we need and this and pretty much all of what we need is provided in the contents of the fstab file.

The rest of the information is related to partitioning within the drives. The first primary partitions are numbered 1-4 and all extended partitions start at 5. You should begin to get the idea when you see the contents of your custom fstab file.

On another note, the free qtparted program is very capable of repartitioning a windows drive, but if the drive has not been fully defragmented and fully compacted prior to repartitioning, it is highly likely it will fail because the windows filing system is an unbelievably sloppy beggar and it dumps files all over the drive.

Mike P

--------------------
Life may not be the party we thought, but while we're here, we may as well dance.
Break M$'s shackles from your feet and free yourself with Mepis

Thanks again for the help.

This morning, I booted the Live CD & am running from it, now.
Here is my fstab:

# Dynamic entries below, identified by 'users' option
/dev/hdd1 /mnt/hdd1 ntfs noauto,users,exec,ro,umask=0222 0 0
/dev/hdd5 /mnt/hdd5 ntfs noauto,users,exec,ro,umask=0222 0 0
/dev/sda1 /mnt/sda1 ntfs noauto,users,exec,ro,umask=0222 0 0
/dev/cdrom /media/cdrom iso9660,udf noauto,users,exec,ro 0 0
/dev/fd0 /media/floppy vfat,ext2 noauto,users,exec,rw 0 0

Curious that the second CD(or DVD) doesn't show up. Is it because there is no disk present in it?

I realize that I will need to create some non-NTFS partitions in order to do a HD install. I had done a defrag prior to attempting the QT&** thing. (Man, that prog is frustrating.)

I realize, also, that I use Windows terminology (it's all I know, for now).

I may acquire an additional drive just for Mepis. Would it be acceptable/possible to boot the thing from a floppy so as not to mess up my Windows drives, again? I'm a bit leery of that GRUB thingy, now.

Thanks, Jerry

BTW, I'm a WVU grad. I noticed that Mepis comes from Morgantown.

Having another hard disk is a good idea, but with your particular layout, you would need to change some things to make it easier to set up. Mepis can boot from any drive or any partition, but for ease of use, it's always easiest to put grub on the first ide channel or the first sata channel for no other reason that the alphabet starts with an "a" and troubleshooting is easier.

There have been some instances when grub would not install to a sata drive using SM6.0, but if that were the case, then nothing would get messed up because the bootloader simply would not change.

You didn't say what version of mepis you were about to try, but I'm guessing it is the stable 6.0 CD version, or the 6.01 dvd version. If you're trying the 6.04 beta1 (read unstable developers release for testing only), it has an option that the stable versions do not during the grub install phase, you can click the back button to install grub to a different location making it possible to install it to both the root of the partition you are installing mepis onto, and the mbr of the hard drive, but sadly, being a beta, this does not always work and I have had it refuse to install grub to the root on 2 separate occasions.

Enough of the raving, lets get to it.

If you choose to install mepis to the sata drive, choose how much disk space you want to allocate for it and repartition your drive as you wish. The best practice in linux is to seperate your system partition (/root) from your data partition (/home) and we highly recommend you create a separate swap partition equal to or 1.5x the size of your installed ram, unless you have more than 512Mb, in which case, I'd stick to a swap partition roughly equivalent to a cd in size. On my system, I have 1.5gb ram and my 1Gb swap is never used, even though I'm a heavy user.

You can choose to have everything on a single partition, but if you do and you attempt an upgrade, it is highly likely you'll lose the contents of your /home, or the equivalent of documents and settings in 2K or XP. If you're just testing the waters, you could opt for a single partition for both /root and /home and of course the separate swap. If you find you really like mepis, you can repartition with a separate /home and reload with more of a working system where your data is on a separate partition, or even drive for that matter.

Now that we have the partitioning sorted out, pop the live cd/dvd into your drive and reboot. In the first section, choose custom install using existing partitions, select the disk you want to install mepis onto and when given the option to select partitions, go through all 3 options for root, home and swap. Just a small note on filesystem choices, ext3 is the most common for the linux partitions, but reiserfs is the fastest, in my tests, 2 x faster than ntfs, 3 x faster than ext3, so if you're interested in speed, choose resierfs for /root and /home

Let the installer do its thing and when prompted for the location of grub, make sure you choose the root of the partition instead of the mbr. Putting grub into root will not alter your mbr and it will not be available when you restart, ie, your computer will appear to be unchanged and windows will start, but we'll get to that later.

Finish the installation keeping the default options and when prompted to restart, do so and let windows start and do all that it needs to regarding the new system it finds but can't recognise on the hard disk. That step is not strictly necessary, but it will give you a sense of security knowing that your "other system" still works. When it and you have been satisfied, boot up again with the live cd/dvd.

When the live mepis is fully up, press your Alt + F2 keys and type mutilities then click the run button, you may need to enter root as the password if you chose to boot using the demo account. Locate the reinstall grub option and choose the disk you installed mepis to using the drop down combo box close to the top right hand corner, then make sure mbr is selected, then click the button at the bottom to install grub. Generally, you can tell if grub was installed correctly because the progress bar moves along for a second or two before a message is displayed saying grub was installed successfully at which time you can shut down and try out your new hard disk installation of SimplyMEPIS linux

If your system boots from or reads the sata disk first, then put grub on the mbr of the sata disk, but if it boots from or reads the ide disk first, then put grub onto that. If you're unsure, put it on both. Grub simply points to your mepis installations /boot folder and displays the contents of the /boot/grub/menu.list and you can use your arrow keys to select your preferred option to boot.

Mike P

--------------------
Life may not be the party we thought, but while we're here, we may as well dance.
Break M$'s shackles from your feet and free yourself with Mepis